Would You Loot?

[GS Rider]

On some other site they were talking about looting after a tornado. And this got me thinking what would you do if your preps were gone or very far away. Lets say something like Kartina. Would you join in with the mob trying to get things out of the local Walgreen's,Walmart ect. Say the event took out your house and your preps or you are out of state. Is it alright to take what is needed to survive and if so when? And can you live with your self if you did STEAL? I will post my answer later but I want to hear what you guys have to say first.

[MdlMkr 7.62]

For me the simple answer is "no". The focus of this website IMHO is learning and practicing preparedness. I want to avoid the problems after any disaster, not become part of the problems. I also feel looting would put me in a dangerous situation - safe at home is the ideal.

7.62

[witchdoctor]

I would have to say YES. I will do what I have to for survival. Hopefully it will not come to that, but running to the local Walmart or what have it will take on a new meaning. As most of us know the food will be gone quickly from the common food stores. I believe you will have to think outside the box and go to the places that have food stored up if you have to get supplies. I am not above looting to get supplies, I am not going to be out there trying to "rescue" a 57" plasma TV from the flood waters. Call me a bastard or whatever you want, survival is just that... it means doing what you have to so you can live another day. Midnight recon missions with a few people to the local food depot maybe a thing you have to do. My plans are to be far enough away to not have to worry about this in the first place.

[Arizona Highlander]

“Every man has his price,” as they say, and if my family was literally starving in the wake of a disaster, I too might be digging through what’s left of Walgreens in the hunt for an odd can of Spam or two. Allowing my family to starve is a worse sin, I guess, than stealing from a wrecked Walgreens.

It might even be borderline permissible, if the food items were perishable and electricity were cut off. No point in being all high-and-mighty about not stealing a tub of ice cream, if it’s going to become a bucket of worthless, melted goo in a few hours anyway.

Anything short of that kind of extreme situation, though, and I’d pass on the looting. Morality tends to fade in disaster situations, but holding on to principles - at least as much as I can - is something that still matters to me. And consider if the shoe’s on the other foot: what if a starving mob is heading MY way, with the intention of relieving me of the survival provisions I’ve stored away? I might have a different view on things then.

Worth emphasizing also that looters are usually more interested in cases of Jack Daniels and big-screen televisions than they are in food. Not much sympathy here for THOSE dudes.

[Dr. X]

I'd like to think that I'm prepared enough to not have to loot, but since I have Lady X to think about (who is blind) and not just myself, I'd be doin' what I had to do to keep body and soul together, period. If that brands me as a "thug", so be it...

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[411man]

Notable points Arizona Highlander. What constitutes LOOTING ? Is there a difference between a disaster following which one knows order will come or a SHTF / TEOTWAWKI type situation where all is in doubt?

[MdlMkr 7.62]

On some other site they were talking about looting after a tornado. And this got me thinking what would you do if your preps were gone or very far away. Lets say something like Kartina.

I think we've gotten off the question in this thread. It's gone from "something like Katrina" to TEOTWAWKI.

7.62

[Ryder]

For something like Katrina I would only Loot if I lost"Everything" and then it would be foodstuff's and other supplies needed to survive until the Federal Response arrived.

[GS Rider]

I am glad that most of you get it. You do what you have to to survive. You can go 30 days without food but 3 days without water. And don't forget meds that you or your family need. Frankly it isn't looting if you pay for it and the store accepts the payment. Even Les Stroud showed the best way to break into a vending machine during a Katrina type situation. And do you think that your families safety and survival is less important than your conscience? Maybe the only thing separating us from the criminals is our preps and how Murphy's law plays against them.

[Carters Cavalry]

No, anything I would have to loot does not belong to me.;what does not belong to me, I have no right to. Period.

If I were in need, I'd barter something or do odd jobs to work for what I needed.

r/
Carters

out of the local Walgreen's,Walmart ect. Say the event took out your house and your preps or you are out of state. Is it alright to take what is needed to survive and if so when? And can you live with your self if you did STEAL? I will post my answer later but I want to hear what you guys have to say first.

[Barbcue]

The real Question is.. Do you happen to be with friends that will ?? Because if they are "Looting"..you will be a "looter 'as well.. and delt with accordingly..NO matter, your intentions

[MdlMkr 7.62]

No, anything I would have to loot does not belong to me.;what does not belong to me, I have no right to. Period.

If I were in need, I'd barter something or do odd jobs to work for what I needed.

r/
Carters

+1 on that

7.62

[Dr. X]

CC and 7.62, I admire your integrity and applaud you for it. Now, let me make myself clear on my stance...I, myself, am willing to endure hardships that I would not suffer on others, especially significant others. I am Lady X's seeing eye-dog and like a dog I'll do my utmost to protect her from whatever might be threatening her. I will not let her do without medicine or food/water on the precept that "it does not belong to me, therefore I have no right to it". When I took on a mate, I took on the weight of responsibility for her care, not just my own, therefore...I may not like it, but I'd do what I had to, because in a SHTF scenario, she'd be helpless without me.

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[GS Rider]

Dr X you nailed it. Very moving answer.

[MdlMkr 7.62]

Guess that makes you a looter

7.62

[Jonas Parker]

In a word, never!

[MdlMkr 7.62]

I was in Florida after Katrina. My friend and I were driving down the road when I saw some wood laying on the side of the road that I thought would be usefull for making some shelves. I wanted to stop but my friend said NO. In Florida they shoot looters, scrap pickers or anyone who appears to be stealing after an emergency - their state law.

It was just junk and not in someone's front yard. I thanked my friend and we motored on down the road.

Steal here, die here seems to be their state motto. My life is worth more than that. In the end I was wrong and my friend saved me. A lesson I learned and won't soon forget.

7.62

[Ryder]

No, anything I would have to loot does not belong to me.;what does not belong to me, I have no right to. Period.

If I were in need, I'd barter something or do odd jobs to work for what I needed.

r/
Carters

And what if everyone you met told you to "shove off"?

Lets take a hurricane like Katrina post 2 days. You lose your house, vehicles and even your BOB. Your on foot in suburban area, local water sources are contaminated with fuel and sewage and its now 98 degrees in the shade.

You haven't had water in 2 days, everyone you have asked for help chases you away. The Federal Response is still at least 3 days away and the last chopper that flew by and dropped the pallet of bottled water was beset on by a angry mob that nearly beat you senseless when you tried to get some.

On the outskirts of town you come across a Mom&Pop convenient store that has been lightly looted. You see several cases of bottled water laying there for the taking. Your wallet is empty and your children are looking at you with dry cracked lips from lack of water.

What are you going to do?

Unless you've been there, you Cannot know for sure what you will do.

[MdlMkr 7.62]

Unless you've been there, you Cannot know for sure what you will do.


I'd agree with that.

If you're a looter, just be careful. You're putting your life in someone's elses hands. Hopefully they're benevolent and won't shoot you for a couple bottles of water. :confused:

Good Luck with that.......;)

7.62

[Dr. X]

Guess that makes you a looter...

More like a quasi-looter or looter-of-last-resort as I wouldn't loot unless lives other than mine depended on it...:cool:

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[MdlMkr 7.62]

More like a quasi-looter or looter-of-last-resort as I wouldn't loot unless lives other than mine depended on it...:cool:

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

I can understand that Dr X.

Be careful if you do it! Getting shot or killed for looting makes it hard to take care of the people who depend on you. :eek:

If it came to it we'd all do things to survive that we don't plan on doing now.



7.62

[GS Rider]

I wouldn't loot a mom and pop store as that is their lively hood and will defend it with deadly force. But the bigger the chain store the less likely you will meet armed resistance. Also the bigger the store the more avenues of escape you will have if threatened. The bottom line for me is never steal from a neighbor or small shop but if you have to hit the bigger retailer. This is not a preparation technique for a natural disaster, just a worst case scenario.

[Slim]

"looting" by definition doesn`t really apply to a real survival situation as far as I`m concerned

looting is for tennis shoes and big screens and anyone who would condemn a man for snatching some bottled water or food out of a store in the event of a crisis, I would consider SELFISH

truth is....who the hell cares about walgreen`s or any other conglomerate?

first off......WATER is owned BY NO ONE......you pay for the bottling and the plastic bottle but the water itself was provided FREE of charge to those who would like nothing more than to make a profit off a planetary resource...in my opinion, those who sell WATER are the REAL looters

second....most folks who would shoot another to protect their profit rather than give thirsty victims some help at the expense of profit ,should themselves be shot....that kind of citizen has no place in our country....you should lend a hand to others when you can as I myself would in the event of a disaster.It`s called selflessness

and for those who say they would never loot...let me ask you this....you are pinned down in front of a gun store and you just drained your last magazine fending off hungry and thirsty attacking "looters"....you know, "protecting" yourself and your family from the attack.......that being said, do you lay there and get shot to pieces and DIE?.....or do you throw a brick through the shop window, reload, and continue protecting your family?....if you answer by throwing the brick, know that I will already be inside helping you help yourself to the ammo to protect your family and yourself

in the same token, would you shoot a man for drinking from a stream on your property?.....I would hope not as you will realize nobody truly can claim ownership to the water on this planet....sure you can claim ownership of a container full of water but the water itself was provided by the Creator

or perhaps those loose pieces of wood you would pick up and use to make a fire once belonged to someone`s house, shed, or tree that was on their property......and since you didn`t pay for that firewoood, wouldn`t that make you a "looter"?......the t-shirt you picked up off the ground after a tornado belongs to another person so do you use it to contain the bleeding on your wife`s thigh from a wound or would you INDEED turn your nose up on the basis of moral righteousness and let her bleed out until you get your own "paid for" shirt off?

and since I don`t care about being morally sound when it comes to protecting the profits and/or assets of a huge corporation hellbent on bleeding mankind dry for a select group of CEO`s and others who would profit greatly on the backs of others who slave away for pennies in poverty and financial ruin...........................................


I will "Loot the F@#$ out of Walmart for food water and survival supplies I need for me and my family.....and honestly, would not care what anyone else would think of my actions

that being said, I would NOT attack, steal, or "loot" a group`s or an individual`s personal survival stash......in my opininion, that would be morally reprehensible......Corporate assets and potential profits, on the other hand, are up for grabs to me and if the manager of the store is hellbent on protecting these "assets" with gunfire, then so be it.....return fire guaranteed


I`m not even going to mention the insurance bought to cover such losses......trust me, corporations won`t miss the emergency provisions I stole.

and since I am working toward provisioning myself rather than waiting to "loot", I hope I may never have to come to that decision.

would you condemn a homeless man for stealing a cheeseburger as well? throw him in prison to teach him that stealing to avoid starvation is not socially acceptable. Rather, he should starve to death waiting for the kindness of others to save him......just sit idly by waiting for someone to come along and save him...just like some of the Katrina victims did......look how well that worked out for them


I guess I am a Thug as well

[MdlMkr 7.62]

Slim, that's an interesting perspective. Convoluted logic but interesting. I won't attempt to say that you're wrong because after reading your reply I can't really get what it is that you stand for. Your reply seems like a rant saying that whatever you do, you're correct. :confused:

If you decide to go down that path, just be carefull. Most property owners will see you as a threat to their posessions and safety and alot of other looters who'll see you the same.

It ain't easy being a "Thug" I guess :eek:


Stay safe :cool:

7.62

[Dr. X]

It ain't easy being a "Thug" I guess...

just ask tupac...:eek: :D

as ever,
Dr. Thug :cool:

[MdlMkr 7.62]

"as ever,
Dr. Thug "



:D :D 7.62 :D :D

[OREGON FAL'ER]

And what if everyone you met told you to "shove off"?

Lets take a hurricane like Katrina post 2 days. You lose your house, vehicles and even your BOB. Your on foot in suburban area, local water sources are contaminated with fuel and sewage and its now 98 degrees in the shade.

You haven't had water in 2 days, everyone you have asked for help chases you away. The Federal Response is still at least 3 days away and the last chopper that flew by and dropped the pallet of bottled water was beset on by a angry mob that nearly beat you senseless when you tried to get some.

On the outskirts of town you come across a Mom&Pop convenient store that has been lightly looted. You see several cases of bottled water laying there for the taking. Your wallet is empty and your children are looking at you with dry cracked lips from lack of water.

What are you going to do?

Unless you've been there, you Cannot know for sure what you will do.
I'd like to think I'd take the water.

[MdlMkr 7.62]

You loot, I'll shoot - warning to looters :eek:

7.62 :cool:

[GS Rider]

You shoot me looting on Walmart property or some other big chain and you will look like an ass when they don't stand behind your decision. Basically you shoot me and when all is said and done me or my family will own your house and any other assets you have. Think before you act. A disaster does not give you the right to shoot someone down in the street.

[GOVT1911]

[QUOTE=Slim;3152]

first off......WATER is owned BY NO ONE......you pay for the bottling and the plastic bottle but the water itself was provided FREE of charge to those who would like nothing more than to make a profit off a planetary resource...in my opinion, those who sell WATER are the REAL looters

QUOTE]

So, since water isn't owned by anyone, you won't mind if I swing by and take all your clean, potable water as long as I leave the containers for ya?

[MdlMkr 7.62]

Think before you act. A disaster does not give you the right to shoot someone down in the street.

Or to steal.

7.62 :cool:

[Bawana Jim]

Well if you would steal from someone else you would steal from me. I would shoot all looters I see for the safety of my family. I wouldn't kill them but shoot them for sure and when they get home to their family they can tell em they got shot for stealing from others.

Warning, you guys want to steal make sure you are ready to kill and die to do it.

jim

[MdlMkr 7.62]

Well if you would steal from someone else you would steal from me. I would shoot all looters I see for the safety of my family. I wouldn't kill them but shoot them for sure and when they get home to their family they can tell em they got shot for stealing from others.

Warning, you guys want to steal make sure you are ready to kill and die to do it.

jim

My feeling too

7.62 :rolleyes:

[Dr. X]

Warning, you guys want to steal make sure you are ready to kill and die to do it...


I don't recall anyone saying they WANTED to steal...:confused:

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[Bawana Jim]

I don't recall anyone saying they WANTED to steal...:confused:

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

If a man figures he has to steal from others rather than barter,trade or just work for it then he has made that decision. Want bad enough to loot is the same as stealing and like I said, better ask yourself if what your doing is worth getting full of holes over.

If your a stranger in my neighborhood you better have empty hands should SHTF or a really first rate first aide kit:D

[Dr. X]

If your a stranger in my neighborhood you better have empty hands should SHTF or a really first rate first aide kit...

No worries Jim, as a "neighborhood" would be the LAST place I'd be when the SHTF...;)

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[Jonas Parker]

Dr. X only wants to "loot" his neighbor's 24 year-old nymphomaniac wife... :p

[Dr. X]

Dr. X only wants to "loot" his neighbor's 24 year-old nymphomaniac wife... :p

The Top Five Reasons Jonas' Statement Is Full Of Crap:

#5) Are you tryin' to give me a heart attack?!!
#4) Built for comfort, not for speed...
#3) If she's 24 and nympho she's probably loaded with STD's...
#2) Like Lady X ain't more than I can handle already...
#1) Above-mentioned Lady X would hack me into curry fer cheatin' on her...

As ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[tedbo]

The Top Five Reasons Jonas' Statement Is Full Of Crap:

#5) Are you tryin' to give me a heart attack?!!
#4) Built for comfort, not for speed...
#3) If she's 24 and nympho she's probably loaded with STD's...
#2) Like Lady X ain't more than I can handle already...
#1) Above-mentioned Lady X would hack me into curry fer cheatin' on her...

As ever,
Dr. X :cool:

But,but,Dr.X,what about your (ahem)babe Rosie O'flabber?:p

[MdlMkr 7.62]

Root, toot and shoot but don't loot :eek:


7.62 :cool:

[Dr. X]

But,but,Dr.X,what about your (ahem)babe Rosie O'flabber?:p

Ted, as usual, you are confused. rosie o is Jonas' sick obsession, not mine...:D

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[GS Rider]

This is like Darwin's theory of evolution. It starts out being about looting and winds up with Dr X and the neighbor Rosie O Donald. I can only imagine that the store he was looting was a donut shop.
You guys have some very interesting answers to this question. If my car breaks down during a disaster and I have to bugout with my get home gear I guess I will just have to fight my way through all of these tuff guys protecting their neighbor hoods. You had better shoot me because you don't recognize me I MIGHT be a looter. Obviously only people that we don't know will loot. I am sure that all of my neighbors that failed to prepare would never take something that wasn't theirs even if they thought they needed it to survive.
Have any of you ever be through a national disaster and if so how did it effect your decision whether to loot or not to survive?

[MdlMkr 7.62]

I've been in 2 civil wars. More like an un natural disaster than a natural one. I pray that we never have anything like that happen on our soil. :eek:

7.62 :cool:

[Dr. X]

This is like Darwin's theory of evolution. It starts out being about looting and winds up with Dr X and Jonas' lover/ neighbor Rosie O...

It's Tedbo's fault...:rolleyes:

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

[Falcon]

No, I wouldn't loot. If it came down to it I would barter for what I need.

[therealsteamer]

As in immediately after the event "gots ta gets me some new kicks" kinda looting, then I will adamantly say no...

However, if it eventually came down to that being one of my only options to provide something of absolute necessity for my wife or daughters AND things were at the level of chaos and anarchy they they were down south Post-Katrina, well.....

I would do what is necessary to take care of me and mine and deal with whatever internal unpleasantness it may have caused on another level....

Want /vs/ Need

[Bawana Jim]

This is like Darwin's theory of evolution. It starts out being about looting and winds up with Dr X and the neighbor Rosie O Donald. I can only imagine that the store he was looting was a donut shop.
You guys have some very interesting answers to this question. If my car breaks down during a disaster and I have to bugout with my get home gear I guess I will just have to fight my way through all of these tuff guys protecting their neighbor hoods. You had better shoot me because you don't recognize me I MIGHT be a looter. Obviously only people that we don't know will loot. I am sure that all of my neighbors that failed to prepare would never take something that wasn't theirs even if they thought they needed it to survive.
Have any of you ever be through a national disaster and if so how did it effect your decision whether to loot or not to survive?

One heavily armed man in a neighborhood could destroy the whole neighborhood. If you come to my neighborhood then you certianly ain't headed for home cause my neighborhood is out of normal travel routes. If you look like your ready for a fight then why should I give you the first shot? IE if your carrying a battle rifle and are weighed down with ammo then you are a threat.

I doubt anyone would convict someone later for shooting heavily armed strangers in their neighborhood. So you better think hard about your route home and what you look like as you travel (maybe dress like a cop). Like I said though I wouldn't shoot to kill cause it ain't in my nature but I won't let the other guy hurt my family and he won't get the first shot:D

jim

[tedbo]

Ted, as usual, you are confused. rosie o is Jonas' sick obsession, not mine...:D

as ever,
Dr. X :cool:

Ah ain'ts cornfused!Facts is facts!:rolleyes: :p

[tedbo]

Bawana Jim,I guess that is the crux of it all.Does the person(s) body language make it seem like they are being cautious so as not wanting a firefight or do they come off as if they are looking to take what they want.I agree with you.
I am in the country enough to where me and the neighbors can spot someone literally a mile away to know if they are from around here or not.They know more people than I do and EVERYONE around here that know them wouldn't be the least bit offended in me asking who they are and who are they visiting.They ALL like it that I care about their friends and kin.It has already been tried and tested!:D Around here folks know who the good folks are and they also know who the bad folk are.They have kept me up to speed when I talk to someone I have met in town,good bad or otherwise.I tell all of them that if they hear something about me or my wife to at least let it be true!:D
We have a means to check out people without someone getting shot.Awareness is the key.If it ever gets to it,there are many places for intersecting fields of fire.I truly hope it never gets to that but I am mentally prepared.

[Bawana Jim]

I ain't "tuff" nor do I go through life being unafraid but I will do the right thing no matter what. I will carry through with the protection of my family first and my neighbors next. I been shot at and scared to death but I still did my job cause that is the only way to get through.

People who loot are thieves first and murderers second in times of emergency. The stuff they steal from others may cause others to become theives too. Plus the stuff they steal may cause others to starve. In a emergency crime takes a heavier toll and should not be tolerated. Plus if they steal from others how long will it be before they come for your stuff. Better to stop it right away.

But thinking in a survival mode I won't kill anyone but will wound them bad enough that they will leave. Jeff Cooper wrote a little on this and I like what he writes.

jim

[tedbo]

Well said and I concur!I too have been shot at and I had a drunk come at me with a very large pigsticker once.Not fun,but I didn't shrink and I have to say I was very happy how I handled it and the turn out.I learned a LOT about myself and that was in itself priceless and rewarding.

[Dean_Martin]

I wouldn't loot. I've enough to keep my family safe and taken care of for a long time. I might poach though, if food was getting scarce but that's another topic.

[rarich]

Hi guys, I am new and I guess I just picked "a big one".:D
I would be situational dependant as far as looting.

A tornado where I could walk out of the destruction zone in a couple of hours? would be a BIG no. I might do some "field picking", but only enough for a meal or two.

Katrina/ natural disaster. where I was flooded out of home, or otherwise separated from my resources, and had to drink/eat or get enough together to get out? Food/Water only, even then I would try and find some sort of trade either service or skill related barter before getting down to theft/looting.

A real big SHTF would have me either up at the mountain, or most of the way to the mountain. I would have no need for looting. If I did and had to feed or water myself and mine? I probably would loot at some point, but I would resolve all other options. Anyone getting "provocative" when I am at the mountain would be looking at the business end of several fire arms very quickly.

When looting I would try and pick a national scale corporation, they have the resources and insurance to cover the damage of my actions. Mom and Pop I would leave alone, you do not crap on your neighbors period. They would be the people you got to to either pool resources with or to get the loot, or to help hold what you got.

TEOTWAWKI would be a big SHTF except that I would either be at the mountain or dead. Any stranger finding me at the mountain had better be polite and willing to trade, otherwise...........

[Beprepared]

Would I loot? A difficult question, what I would have to reply, what the situation?

When push came to shove and I really need medical supplies or food, then I guess so, but only from places that won't use it (abandoned places, vehicles) then up to large national corporations (as someone posted, they can afford it)

As someone once said, its better to ask forgiveness than permission.

A definately would think loooong and hard before approaching someone to ask/barter for materials, because they will be as wary as I would be about someone asking for help.

[MiamiARFan]

Ummm Yeah, try walking into your local supermarket with a bunch of empty containers and filling them from their bottled water isle.

That said, I would "loot" only what it took for me to ensure my families survival and only from unoccupied buildings. I will not loot for profit or non survival supplies.

Now with that said: hopefully my preps will prevent this from occurring. I would also try to barter if there are others who have supplies that I need with either what I have or what services I can provide.

[Ponce]

The name of this site should tell you what to do.......

To be a "survivalist" means that you want to come out alive out of any situation no matter what you have to do, specially if you have a familie that depends on you.

[GS Rider]

Well put Ponce. Some people seem to look at this as a test of their morals.